damn small linux

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damn small linux

Postby oldpenguin » Sun Jan 19, 2014 1:58 am

Damn Small seems to have new life coming.

I tried their forum, but found it is being trashed
just like the old forum was. I think the forum uses
software close to this site. This one doesn't get trashed.

I like DSL because I can run it in ram without hard drives.
Seems my system doesn't get trashed as often this way.
Still had a few hateful things done to a flash drive however.

I dislike the newer LiveCD/DVDs because they are too
weighted down with cumbersome software from the get go.
If I want cups for example, I can turn it on manually.

Still, DSL has not kept up with the times. Firefox needs to come
up with a stripped down express version for many of the smaller distros,
as other programs and apps could do as well.
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Re: damn small linux

Postby Dutch_Master » Sun Jan 19, 2014 3:08 am

oldpenguin wrote:Firefox needs to come
up with a stripped down express version for many of the smaller distros
No they don't. First, the Mozilla people aren't obliged to anything and then there's a fair number of light-weight alternatives to FF that would fit DSL's user requirements.

DSL will struggle in future, as memory is so cheap these days that one could easily afford sufficient RAM for a decent, recent mainline Linux distro. It doesn't mean nobody will want to use DSL anymore, but there's hardly a need for it, except for some instances perhaps. ;) :roll:
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Re: damn small linux

Postby oldpenguin » Sun Jan 19, 2014 4:16 am

Dutch_Master wrote:No they don't. First, the Mozilla people aren't obliged to anything and then there's a fair number of light-weight alternatives to FF that would fit DSL's user requirements.


I'd be happy with LYNX if it was useful for everything.
I think what the younger crowd is looking for is a brower that
that will work with YouTube, and Adobe... and a few other
UNopensource items. I am very open to sugestions here.

On the other hand, one shouldn't have to run to the store
for the latest whiz-bang feature because their current system has
been deemed obsolete. When I read about needing more ram,
more CPU power, I am amused because a lot of current systems
have less than the antique I use. I don't need a big drive - I don't store
movies or the like. I don't require an operating system with dozens of
deamons swapping in and out, or multiple processors...

Um, got carried away...

Look, I like DSL and DSL like setups because they are small.
If I wanted a Windows computer, I'd get one. (actually I have a few).
It's not a contest. The bigger distros seem to be caught up in
trying to outmatch Window systems instead of developing their
own identitiy. I was so happy to see something over UNIX. Linux has
features that M$ will never freely give. How about a few OS setups
that revive older equipment in a meaningful way? There's no magic
required - just a will to "make it so"...
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Postby guy » Sun Jan 19, 2014 10:18 am

Mozilla made a decision a few years back along the lines of, "Hey, these modern computers have enough memory to stuff the world inside, yet we have been chiselling away at our own memory requirements. How mad is that? If it's there, let's start using it!" So Firefox is quite the wrong browser for DSL.

The average smartphone OS is bloated in comparison to the likes of DSL, and Firefox is too bloated even for them.

I think DSL has more of a future in embedded devices, things like the Raspberry Pi, smart watches, quadcopters and stuff, where power consumption will always be a major issue. I mean, doesn't the idea of running DSL on a quadcopter nudge your pulse up that teeny little bit?
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Postby purplepenguin » Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:51 am

guy wrote: I mean, doesn't the idea of running DSL on a quadcopter nudge your pulse up that teeny little bit?


Oh yeah.
So it looks like I'm back to LinuxMint again. Why you ask? Because my machine smell nicer.

I'm not too sure I'd want a Mint and Cinnamon muffin with my brew though. Guess I'm lucky they don't run my local bakery.
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Postby oldpenguin » Sun Jan 19, 2014 3:22 pm

here, here...

They even out did GIMP, or Open Office.

My idea or "power" is "processing power", not amperage.
Most of it is un-needed except in the mind of those who want bigger and faster for names sake. Yes, programs use it because it's there and spin a bunch of
child processes that (usually) are not in the users interest.

But that's another subject. They are looking to revive DSL, there is interest,
I'm one of them. where are those who are tinkering as well as actually using?

Put it this way, I have an Atari game. The thing has maybe 16K of memory. YES "K"... to use this in a "computer" now requires a minimum OS, a terabyte of memory, and a bazillion bytes of storage space. Come on, who we kidding?

Like Firefox, they use what's available because it's there...
the solution for unoptimised programming requires bigger and faster.
Pretty soon M$ and others will win, because (real) computers will become obsolete and replace the TV, RADIO, PHONE, media players, etc.
And you know what else? They don't come with compilers, and all that icky geeky crap.

oh darn - went off in some weird direction again.
[/quote]
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Postby purplepenguin » Sun Jan 19, 2014 5:52 pm

oldpenguin wrote:I'm one of them. where are those who are tinkering as well as actually using?
[/quote]

I love tinkering with RPIs etc. One of the things that really interests me with Linux is the myriad of distros for different occasions.

I love using something like Mint/OpenSuse/Debian on my main PC with 16GB of RAM and huge HDD. I can do what I need at a very quick pace. Running 2.3 or even 4 VMs and two instances of FF, Converting video files, editing photos, writing sketches for Arduino all at the same time. It's got nothing to do with "name sake".

I'm no expert at programming. But how is it unoptimised to allow a program to use the full resources available? Surly it's the other way around. Restricting a program to use the bare minimum and leaving all that goodness unused. (Hmm will I get flamed for that?).

I'm really interested in DSL/Tiny Core too. for running minimalistic kiosks and embedded systems. I have a copy installed in a VM, although I've not had the time to play too much with it yet.
I'm currently in the very early stages of planning for revamping our house alarm. I want to replace the main board with an RPI or similar and DSL looks great for this.

PP
So it looks like I'm back to LinuxMint again. Why you ask? Because my machine smell nicer.

I'm not too sure I'd want a Mint and Cinnamon muffin with my brew though. Guess I'm lucky they don't run my local bakery.
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Postby oldpenguin » Tue Jan 21, 2014 11:57 am

I reluctantly agree to most of what I've read here.
I am looking to build a RaspPi for nothing more than
reading E-mail, and the like...
I think what has me is that whenever I try and poke
around DSL, I discover an almost organized attempt
to squash it. Bet this site has seen more than normal
"site-bashing", too. And it's only because it's LINUX.
still, what could replace DILLO and FIREFOX and have
the non-opensource software allowing streaming videos,
watching YouTube, and a few other features?
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Postby nelz » Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:41 pm

Isn't DSL still stuck with a 2.4 kernel because of the arbitrary 50MB limit imposed by an obsolete media format that hardly anyone used when it was around - the business card CD?

If the project has stagnated, it is a good sign that the original goals no longer appeal to a critical mass of developers and users. There are plenty of other lightweight distros out there.
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." (Albert Einstein)
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Postby oldpenguin » Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:42 pm

nelz wrote:Isn't DSL still stuck with a 2.4 kernel because of the arbitrary 50MB limit imposed by an obsolete media format that hardly anyone used when it was around - the business card CD?.


Actually - this is true.
I have my version on a mini-CD (also a mini-dvd).
Loaded them with DSL extensions.

Hey, John, if you bother looking here... How about a push
forward with "DARN SMALL LINUX", how much can you
stuff on a mini CD, or a mini-DVD, with the same small
sys responsiveness?

Gee? There's a short article here for LinuxFormat.
There are lots of other small distros which could fit in here.
Perhaps a super initrd.tar.gz with a shoping list startup
and a library crop of binaries with whatever kernel for
their support.
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Postby nelz » Tue Jan 21, 2014 6:43 pm

If you want responsiveness, use a USB drive rather than an optical disc. Far more portable and much faster when working from live media.

And no artificial size limits :)
"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." (Albert Einstein)
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Postby purplepenguin » Tue Jan 21, 2014 9:35 pm

oldpenguin wrote:
I am looking to build a RaspPi for nothing more than
reading E-mail, and the like...
?


Why don't you use Raspbian?
So it looks like I'm back to LinuxMint again. Why you ask? Because my machine smell nicer.

I'm not too sure I'd want a Mint and Cinnamon muffin with my brew though. Guess I'm lucky they don't run my local bakery.
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Postby towy71 » Tue Jan 21, 2014 11:39 pm

purplepenguin wrote:
Why don't you use Raspbian?
Funnily enough I was thinking just the same thing, my Pi came with several options for installs but so far I have only used raspbian cos it just works :wink:
still looking for that door into summer
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Postby dandnsmith » Wed Jan 22, 2014 8:34 am

If you want a more complete installation, then have a look at pidora
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Postby purplepenguin » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:48 am

dandnsmith wrote:If you want a more complete installation, then have a look at pidora


I've not used Pidora. What do you mean by more complete? What is the difference between it and Raspbian? Other than the obvious package management.

I think there is also an Arch remix for the Pi.
So it looks like I'm back to LinuxMint again. Why you ask? Because my machine smell nicer.

I'm not too sure I'd want a Mint and Cinnamon muffin with my brew though. Guess I'm lucky they don't run my local bakery.
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